Avi
France, Romania Bulgaria can point fingers at each other forever, but ones you visit India it totally clarifies matters and you see where the Roma issue is and how fruitless it is to blame Europe's problems.

Not all gipsies are problematic anymore than all Indians are like the gipsies.

It's just a very strong culture and tradition that simply cannot be changed, not with the fast birth rate anyway.
One by one, sure, any one can be thought to live in a home, to register births, educate [...]

Read the full comment kids, but with the Romas and most Indians sky high birth rate, it a lot like draining the ocean with a bucket.
No xenophobia here, just facts...

India is ready to take back the Roma...happily. Does that mean that the "Civilized" Europeans will be kicked from the countries they live? Anglo-Saxons, Italians from US? French from Canada? Somebody commented about Mumbai...lol. Why are you so xenophibic about the asians? Don't you know it's asian century? Grow up dude!

Unfortunately, the Roma/Gypsies have a country, and it's now Bulgaria/Romania/EU. That's where they're from, and you can't go back in history hundreds of years to expel them. Sorry, it just won't work. If you wanted to use this argument, then most residents in the United States, Canada, Argentina, and Chile could be deported back to their respective countries. Why? the Native Americans/American Indians were the only ones living there until the 1500/1600s. So, they should have their land back, and we'll back to our countries of origin. Most Americans will be in the EU.

Further, the [...]

Read the full comment Roma/Gypsy problem is an EU problem, not simply a Bulgarian/Romanian problem. I'd agree with Aries that they are nomadic, but they are nomadic citizens with EU passports. Yeah, some of their customs completely need to change, like teenage pregnancy, teenage marriage, and value of education. There's major distrust the both Roma and Europeans need to get over. But at the same time, it's a problem the EU has to solve. It would be helpful if the EU actually kept track and did programs that helped the Roma. Rather, they throw money randomly into programs that don't help Roma, and don't keep track to see if this money is actually spent on the Roma. Too often in Bulgaria, EU money given to municipalities are given to set up NGOs simply created to take the money, and do little to actually help the Roma. The money goes into someone's villa fund, or Audi fund. The EU doesn't demand to keep track of any real statistics, so it's just throwing money into a black hole.

For all the hatred and mistrust you have towards Roma, there's also major mistrust and hatred from the Roma towards Europeans. Did one think to consider this? Maybe they remember how Europeans treat them, and then not to trust you as a result. It's the same with race relations in the US. Like with the Roma, there are lots of programs to help deal with race problems. They are more successful, but there are still major problems with minority education, employment rate, crime, and relations between races.

I've heard similar comments said by Americans about blacks, hispanics, and asians. And each time, it's really just an excuse to not deal with the true problem they have with other people. And with the Roma, this is exactly what the EU policy is currently doing with this issue. The current EU policy is simply an excuse not to deal with fixing the problem, which is really sad.

1. Well, I think ONE WAY ticket to India is best solution. During Communism in Bulgaria, Gypsies could get a job – dirty jobs but with twice bigger salary than a Bulgrian teacher – now unemployed have to steal more in order to survive… They will probably return to France or other country, where the population is bigger and more easy to cheat. Probably Bulgarians are not that easy…

2. Its time for France and other Western countries, to raise their new citizens in good manner, educate them and give them jobs, that no European youth [...]

Read the full comment would like to have anuway. Bulgaria was once a Democratic land – long before the so called Western countries – and accepted the Gypsies to live in their land when they were persecuted in West and ben thrown out. Further, Bulgaria cannot take responsibility for all shit that Westerns once did not want to have. West have to prove that they are “Democratic” as they use to boast highly. West must taka back a part of these…

....???

They have a country Anthony, it'd called India.
India is one big Roma camp. Even before your plane lands in Mumbai, you get it, trust me...

My good man Anthony you simply do not get "The Story"
Romas or Gypsies are wanderers (nomadic people) they cannot settle down it has alwats been that way always will be. Some do assimililate with the their hosting countries a 5% the other
95% remain bound to and firmly maintain their peculiar customs.

The fact that power shovels were used to crush the trailers owned by Gypsies is outrageous. France should pay reparations to the Gypsies,because paying reparations to them would be the only way for the French government to apologize for what they have done. If I lived in Europe,I would want to beg the government of the European Union to give the Gypsies a country of their own. It doesn't have to be a big country. It's okay if it's small. If it's a piece of land that's only one kilometer wide,and one kilometer long,that will be alright. If the Gypsies [...]

Read the full comment had their own country,they would have their own nationality,and they would not have to call themselves Bulgarians or Romanians. A state of the their own would build their dignity,and would establish them as responsible members of the international community. If I lived in Europe,I would beg the government to give the Gypsies their own country. The French government should be advised that stateless persons have rights. There are international treaties that have established the rights of stateless persons,and the Gypsies certainly are stateless persons,since Bulgaria doesn't want them,Romania doesn't want them and France doesn't want them. The Gypsies whose trailers were crushed by French Nazis are stateless people,and they should be entitled to reparations,under international treaties that established the rights of stateless individuals.

Lol the Dreyfus affair!
I didn't think any one still knows of it!
It a bit like the Cataline's affair that gave Cicero the bragging rights of a lifetime, but sadly forgotten;)

I've always thought that it's a miracle that Hitler wasn't French! Perhaps it isn't possible to get enough French an the same page long enough to stage a Reich of some sort, but it's the effort and the intend that counts;)

After all, it was France that staged the great anti-Semitic debacle against Jews. Remember the Dreyfus affair?
Granted, the Germans went overboard with it, but they got the idea from France.
Chatov, Valeri is corect. Any citizen of any EU counrty is free to move about in any EU country.
However, I haven't seen the TV clips, so it may be justified. But I still don't trust the French to do the right thing. Or to do anything right.

The iPhone has such a small window that it's painful to scroll up and down - this is why you get these half sentences..

No Expat, there's nothing like that involved.

They enter France probably by road so there is no way for the French authorities to know exactly when that might have happen - remember no borders and all you
need in an ID anyway.
Yes having had a job there might tip off the French that you overstayed, but since we are talking about Gypsies, fat chance of that happening.

The round up is probably violating EU laws and is purely ridding the country of vermin that [...]

Read the full comment is beyond redemption.

It's a bit like the boat is sinking and they are saving the bell though.
France is so Islamic that in comparison the Roma are pretty harmless.
Too bad..

If they catch you having worked there

I see what you're saying Valeri. :) I was under the impression that these people were deported primarily because they had not met or sustained the working visa requirements that France imposes (and others) on select EU member states, thus they were considered to be there illegally.

NOW AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME. PEOPLE CAN CHOOSE ON WHICH PART OF THIS PLANET TO LIVE AND WORK. THAT IS WORK AND LIVE TO NORMAL STANDARDS. AS I HAVE WORKED AND LIVED ON MANY MANY PARTS OF THIS PLANET.

It's a little bit different Expat.
The US isn't in Union with Mexico.
Technically no Bulgarian born individual is "illegal" in any EU country.
Ideally the Romas should be deported to India, but that's impossible so the French are doing the next best thing - dumping the Gipsy problem back in our back yard...

what an absurd historical comparison! and french bishops wonder why churches in france are so empty??? mind your flock!

Ivaylo, I appreciate your comments and would extrapolate them to anyone who is critical of France's policy to enforce their laws. Are they willing to take these people in? Of course not. We were in Paris a few months ago and we saw the gypsies begging and it was just awful. We watched them one day while sitting at a cafe (with a bottle of wine) near the international train station. People could barely get out of their cars or taxis without being accosted by a gypsy with a sign in English asking for money (and I mean literally with [...]

Read the full comment their faces pressed to the car window). Every time they approached us, I spoke to them in Bulgarian and they couldn't get away from us fast enough. Whether they were from BG or not, I have no idea but the point was that they thought I was an English speaker (ok, they were right) who is an easy mark.

The U.S. has its own illegal immigration problems to contend with, but you won't hear that from our "president". Rather than dealing with illegal immigration (which is the real problem) it gets cloaked in human rights and racial discrimination terminology, just as in this case with France. In my mind, Sarkozy (and France in general) has every right to enact and enforce its immigration policies as it sees fit.

Well done France.

I think this is actually a positive development.
If France, a core EU country, would attempt to solve Roma problem by forceful removal, and get away with it, then that gives a degree of precedent that will free our own government to deal with them in more productive ways - like removal and denial of freedom of movement as well as forceful education and forceful protection of their women and children - things we couldn't do until now, for legal pressure from various EU organizations...

I thought the French were being callous until they showed the gypsy camps on TV. You would not want to live near this lot. People work hard and pay their taxes and their mortgages and then a load of caravans
with no sanitation and no rubbish disposal arrangements take up residence nearby making you house
values fall to the floor - even worse than the recession.
Sarkozy is doing his job - protecting the interests of the French people. I wish the British
politicians paid the same attention
to the [...]

Read the full comment ordinary people of the UK.
These Roma are not your average Romanian/Bulgarian. And they live by begging, not trying to work.

hard to understand why france is taking so much flak for doing the right thing by deporting illegal immigrants.
if the americans are complaining, they are welcome to issue the lot with green cards.

When will people realise that the ball is rolling and we are on our way to global citizenship. Nationalism, together with all its shoddy trappings, is dead.

No one can stop it and, hopefully, within my lifetime we will all be able to choose on which part of this (our) planet we want to live and work.