People were not allowed to claim sovereignty Serbia would have been still in the Bulgarian empire. Luckily under Tito's (a Croatian) leadership they managed to created Yugoslavia (a Bulgarian idea) to become one of the best countries in the world. Unfortunately under the leadership of Milosevic (a Montenegrin) you managed to destroy all that and descend to the level of crime ridden Albania (or Bulgaria) There is nothing to be proud of in this situataion.

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The curse of the typo - for 'lick' of course read 'kick'.

Apologies to all.

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This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained foul, abusive or discriminating language

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained foul, abusive or discriminating language

"Do you honestly believe that you won anything in the Balkans? If it wasn't for NATO Serbia whould've kicked your a**e and you know it."

hahaha, you got some problems remembering that slovenia and croatia handed your ar5 to you before that. your serb barbarians were fighting unarmed civilians,elderly and children. pathetic. with your contrast we should of let the nazzis take over the world too.

You are pathetic in bringing up real arguments.

belgrade and berlin the first judenfrei citys... remember that you fascist supporter!
[...]

Read the full comment enjoy your national hero's who are hidding like rats for the genocides they commited. funny how servs retreat and retreat, than they come to this sites and bull5i7 like you.

Troika, you should bow your head in shame and not come here trying to make others look bad.
At least Serbia has always been ready to fight unlike you who are such cowards that you immeditely cry like babies and beg NATO, Hitler or whoever to come and fight for you.
Do you honestly believe that you won anything in the Balkans? If it wasn't for NATO Serbia whould've kicked your a**e and you know it.

You are only brave when the big guy has your back. Let's see what happens to [...]

Read the full comment you when NATO abandons you because you are no longer important to US.

You know what they say. Nemoj da se kitis sa tudjim zlatom.

"Bulgaria ‘again stabbed Serbia in the back’, Belgrade says"

What a big lie.
Sirbia dosnt have a back, or a spine. People that celebrate a millitary loss from 600 years ago, retreats in ww1, and waits for rusky 'liberation' in ww2, and theit national heros are found in caves looking like saddam and osama in hidding. NO Serbs dont have a back. they got worn out knees from looking up to much.

True.
Ancestral hate isn't limited to the Balkans, but its delayed occurrence that's the joke here.
The French-German hate went for centuries. In fact, as you know the real unifier of Germany wasn't Bismarck, but Napoleon, who can certainly be considered the father of German and Russian nationalism.
Reminds me of the young Wilhelm presenting the German Embassy in Paris with an oil painting of himself dressed in black cuiasse of a Garde du Corps, brandishing a field marshal's baton, looking particularly aggressive. When seen by an "eminent French general" caused him to remark: [...]

Read the full comment "This portrait in a declaration of war"!

Arkan - ancestral hate-memories such as you have just described are precisely what is wrong with the Balkans ! (Not just Serbia, but your example of Serbs 'not forgiving' is very pertinent).

Yeah Arkan,
we're all shaking, I am sure....

Everyone who stabs Serbia in back will eventually pay the ultimate price. God forgives Serbs dont.

Nobody stabbed serbia in the back...Serbia stabbed her self in the ass..And dont blame Bulgaria for that..Ubrigens Ludvig ihre traume werden nie wahr werden ...Dream on.

No problem Aries, as I said - nice of you to try:)

Ludvig,
I keep musing over your example of: "We have a cat and a dog. Both are very teritorial and cute." as somehow the opposite of the Serb state of mind in all that Kosovo business. I think "territorial" is the key here... I mean even literally.

Valeri.
Many thanks for your correction
about срам и позор comment of mine
pertaining to the pension.

Man kann nie wissen was kann man
moch tun soweit ich mich erinnern kann.

Well Ludvig,
You must be pretty young if you believe that disregard for family, incest, and thoughtless acting on carnal desires, belong strictly in the animal world.
Thousands of children get raped and killed, often by a parent or relative, in "your" country, the US every year. Packs of humans, hunt down large groups of other humans, for the sole purpose of extermination - like in Africa and in your native land of the former Yugoslavia - apparently because of graves and frescoes....
I seriously doubt that animals can even compete with humanity in [...]

Read the full comment cruelty and savagery, so no, that's not what separates us from the animals.

What makes us different is the ability to predict our action's effect on our long term self-interests.
You are in the US and that my friend is a worse "stab in the back" of Serbia than anything BG can possibly do. Extreme tribalism, has the effect of rendering your land unlivable, and so you leave for a better life, and have your children 9000 km away. That is exactly how you lose, your land, your traditions, your culture and yes your graves and frescoes...

So it's your instant reaction to emotion and fear, or the cohesive and deliberate approach to survival, that determines which of God's creatures are you happen to be closer to...

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Valeri,
Das, worüber Sie gesprochen haben, ist nicht eine Tatsache/Tatsachen, darüber man sich festhalten kann.
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We have a cat and a dog. Both are very teritorial and cute. But both of them have no clue about the PAST, nor FUTURE. They only live for THIS MOMENT. If the dog tomorrow meets his sister or mother, without slightest hesitation, he would mount them both. They couldn't care less about emotions, morals, they have no plans; they live only for TODAY, as you would put it - for REALITY. More precisely, they [...]

Read the full comment live only for food. The rest are the traits - instincts, which they are born with.
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You see, we the people are completely different. We have our past, traditions, culture. We have our parents, grandparents, great-great parents, we have the graves, memories, churches, frescoes, we have our specific, ways how we celebrate, love, hate....If you hit me in the nerve, I could carry you around ... We do not forget, people remember... As they used to say - "Bulgarians stabbed us AGAIN in the back"...

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P.S.: Your "accept reality" argument gives you away

There does seem to be a great deal of sense in Valeri's most recent posting. I suggest we all read it thoroughly and reflect.

Ludvig,
yesterday I had lunch with a childhood friend, who happens to be involved in BGs foreign affairs in the new government and he actually describes a similar lack of realism on part of many Serbian officials too, but he thinks it's probably because their stands are dictated by popular pressure, which isn't reasonable as a rule..
Whereas I don't believe that a group of people can posses similar qualities, they can certainly be subject to common physiological reaction to a given situation.
Much of what you say about US and China may be [...]

Read the full comment true, but probably not as applicable to Serbia's situation, as you apparently like to believe.

What 's clear is that Serbia DOES NOT want the Kosovo Albanians back in Serbia. At this point that would be a demographic suicide. What's also clear is that Serbia isn't getting the land without the people - it just isn't happening - you have to face that fact.

If you, as a country, accept this pretty solid reality, then perhaps you can make "some lemonade out of these lemons" as the Americans say. If you don't, you'd lose much more - case in point - Monte Negro didn't have to go, had Serbia been more reasonable on Kosovo. Similarly, there is a possibility of uniting with Republica Srbska, but only if Serbia is wise enough to make other compromises - perhaps with the Muslim populated lands around Monte Negro, as to help make Bosnia more viable, with the potential loss of her Serb part.

If the goal is to have a more homogeneous, contiguous Serbia, then you guys are sabotaging that at every step, by being stubborn about land for which you have no prospect of reclaiming nor would you want to, realistically.

Since you bring the US up, perhaps this is a good example to consider:
As you know, whole States that are becoming majority Hispanic and yet, there is little appetite among them to separate and reunite with Mexico. The reason is that the US - like them or not, (not in my case) are pretty good in co-opting minorities, by offering them a better life and opportunities, than they would have outside the fold - that is the basic prerequisite for any imperial ambition.
You, yourself refer to the US as "our" and "us", a country that 10 years a go, bombed you native land back to the 19th century. They have co-opted you too! Think about that!
That is exactly what Serbia is incapable of - making minorities feel that they prefer to stay with in the fold.

BGs hope is to convince our Turkish minority, for example, that BG has better future than Turkey, and that the fact that they happen to be Turkish, isn't making too much real difference in their day-to-dat life in BG. If we don't, then we will join Serbia in her unfortunate road to misery, hate, separatism and human tragedy.
If we do, than we will have a more livable, affluent and European country. Luckily we have politicians who see that, or perhaps something in our national psychic, helps us elect such people - who knows...

"To win (Valery's "never, never.."), you have to be RIGHT first, in the first place.

Albanians are fine people, unless they are manipulated, which is wjhat happened after Clinton's sex scandal. In any case that has nothing to do with Kosovo. Kosovo is Srbija." Ludvic

Hahaha, do you always start with retarded manipulations like that?

So according to you after Clinton blew, the serbs just became criminals all of a sudden?

I feel sorry for you, brainwashed little boy, luwinsky was not on her [...]

Read the full comment knees yet when serbs atacked slovenia, than croatia.
With ignorance like yours, i feel so much better reading the serb "side", pathetic "victims" who climb from branch to branch in order to justify the greatest genocide after hitler. Your rapes looting burning of innocent people will haunt you doesn even after you will beg on your knees scraaming "Kosovo je Shqiptare".

Remember buddy you are talking about a group of parasites that Mladic is a national hero. You and your kind are more than just comparabla to genocide callers, and neo fascist scum that is left over in that landlocked cave.

To win (Valery's "never, never.."), you have to be RIGHT first, in the first place.

Albanians are fine people, unless they are manipulated, which is wjhat happened after Clinton's sex scandal. In any case that has nothing to do with Kosovo. Kosovo is Srbija.

...nuisance typo: shoes

One of the reasons why communism had collapsed in every corner of the world is BECAUSE PEOPLE DID NOT HAVE A RIGHT TO FAIL. There was always someone to pick you up. The socialism/communism is a paradise for lazy and stupid people.
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One of the reasons that the Serbs are nowadays near the very top in tennis, soccer, handball, volleyball, waterpollo, karate, judo, pistol shooting etc, in my humble opinion is - because of illegal bombing and Kosovo occupation.
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Take for instance Novak Djokovic, [...]

Read the full comment Jeca Jankovic & Ana Ivanovic. I am sure if it were not for the bombing, you would never hear from these two. They are the product of a famous/infamous Serbian "inat" coupled with the Newtonian reaction to injustice. Djokovic's father comes from Kosovo, mother is a Croatian Serb. The two beauties (Jeca & Ana) are Montenegro Serbs.
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Valery, you are so wrong in your exchange with Peggy. You said Kosovo will never be Serbian, never, never... So much you know.
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If you follow all these discussions and argument in ICJ, the other side relies only - the I.L. is silent in this case, (after Clinton's sex scandal) Serbs opressed nice/noncursing Albanians, we extracted Kosovo from Serbia by force, nobady will ever be able to take it back... That is also your point in away.
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Now watch this. Our (US) economy is worth about 14.5 trillion dollars ($14,500,000,000). Total E.U economy is a little less than 14 trillion dollars. Chinese economy is about one half our economy in size. The Russian econnomy is one tenth of ours economy. For the last 100 years, US economy was the largest in the world. Goldman Sachs has come up with tables, showing that China will surpass the U.S. economy by 2027! They assume a linear steady growth 10% for China and 2% for the US, which is about right. That also may happen sooner, or later, because nothing in life goes in a monotone straight progression. Economies are cyclical and subject to unpredictable spurs. For example We are right now in a worst economic slump since 1930's. China owns about 60% of our T-bills and other g-financial instruments. If they took that out tomorrow, the US economy would collapse instantly! They cannot do that, because that would be suicidal for them. But the sheer fact that they could do humbles the U.S. You never hear "human rights abuses" in China, do you? Only a couple of years ago, we were giving China a regular public reprimand. Our entire manufacturing industry has been moved/ given away mostly to China and then to Mexico. We do not make any "stuff" here. The Chinese are doing it for us. That Chinese monopoly makes us totally dependent on China. Be assured when China becomes the biggest economy in the world (I hope that day never comes) our U.S. will not be the only military superpower. All thaey have to do is to call the White House and say: >>Do you want us to slap economic sanctions on you guys? Starting from next Monday noon, your kids will not be able to get new shows, backpacks and lunch boxes, if you do not get rid of that so called "Kosova" Republjika<<

Valeri, for the sake of peace of mind I will not debate you any longer.
Have it your way. You know the saying. Pametniji popusta.

As far as my view of Slavs:
Peggy is this what you read in my comments - that I don't think much of Slavs?

Peggy not all people think like that, I would avoid having an opinion about one family, let alone one ethnic group.

I can only have an opinion only about the Slavs I know, from my relatives to my friends and any one that I've actually met.
The rest is social observation and what I was describing was the effect of socialism - low birth [...]

Read the full comment rate, dependence on government to babysit, to the weakening of the family structure - that is what most socialist countries suffer from and we especially, because our brand of socialism was particularly catastrophic.
Where did you see an indictment of an ethnic group, I'll let you figure out.

Peggy,
all ethnographic maps show Kosovo at most 50% Serbs at the time the Serb army moved in, in 1913. (Probably 90% Albanian when the Serb army tired to expel them from there in 1999.)

Makedonia had almost no Serbs, at that very same invasion i 1913.
That's what any BG government will see. I am just sharing that with you. The rest is pretty immaterial to us. BG usually doesn't interfere in third party disputes. This is the only exception for the above stated reasons.
Again, the topic of [...]

Read the full comment the article is "Stabbed in the Back" and my contention is that it's a false notion, based ignorance.

That said, Serbia has been represented by notoriously inept politicians, who also conducted a disastrous foreign PR job. Had they have a reasonable grasp of the situation, there would've opted for some sort of land division and population exchange skim that would've left Serbia with most her cultural sites and more homogeneous population make up.
As it were, they were uncompromising, to Serbia's detriment.
Actually I personally see a mirror image Kosovo - Republica Srbska dynamic.
Serbia could've extracted recognition and eventual unification with that entity in exchange for the same in Kosovo, which is so Albanian that's never going back to Serbia - really Peggy - never.
Frankly I am not so sure why would Serbia wanted it to, since it will come with fast breeding, Serb hating population, that will eventually destroy the rest of Serbia, if reunited. Make no illusion that Serbia will get land without people. So you have to ask yourself the question: what is it that Serbia wants?
Republica Srbska on the other hand is almost all Serb at this point and could've enlarged Serbia enough to make up for the loss of Kosovo, with land that's always had Serbs, but never belonged to Serbia proper, as Kosovo hasn't belonged to Albania proper, but has had Albanians for centuries..

One thing most Bulgarians don't realize is how fortunate we've been with politicians - (I know some Bulgarian will throw tomatoes my way) - drastically different from you guys. Serbia was much better off, economically and internationally and was ruined by politicians. BG was a disaster, saved by politicians. Like I said, our EU membership is a political achievement, with little popular contribution short of voting for the right people.

Peggy, being unbending sometimes will achieve little beyond breaking your back. Serbia has been too steadfast with her goals and this is why she is at this junction = not because BG stabbed her in the back...

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

Anonymous Ludvig Boltzmann Sun,

"She gave you common knowledge."

Common knowledge is the world is round, serbia is still has rats who are wanted on genocide charges.

do you have links showing immigration or not?

damn you serbs are retards with selective attention when it comes to scrutinising your fake fabrications. the sad thing is that everything is fake in your landlocked cave.
Your pathetic rhetoric is low enough to link serbian animals butchering elderly and kids, raping woman, [...]

Read the full comment and killing unarmed civilians to luwinsky.
your delusional kind are endengered, but as long as you have general mladic as your hero, what can normal people expect from barbarians of your kind???

And what is this "low level confluict"??? where serbs could butcher unchecked?? were they had immunity against all 'others'.

at least you know that you are the living toilet ball in the balkans, useless parasites.

Valeri I see that you don't think much of Slavs and again that's your own opinion to which you are entitled to but I have a very different opinion.

Slavs are the more social and giving people. I am not only talking about Serbs but all Slavs including Poles, Ukranians etc.
Our people have a lot to be proud of and should preserve certain characteristics. We have some characteristics which are not so great like volatility but again there have to be two sides to anything for the sake of balance.

[...]

Read the full comment /> Do you mean to imply that Kosovo was populated by Albanians, Serbs came conquered and took over? Please do give me a direct answer to that question.
You seem to imply that this is exactly the way it happened.
Even if it did, which I don't agree with then you will have to say the same about white Americans and Australians. Do you advise the Yanks to hand over America to Indians to govern because the white man was an invader and took their land?

How far do we go back to redraw the maps?

Does Bulgaria now give the land back to the rightful owenrs?

Why is it that all these people can stay on the land now after it was conquered but not the Serbs who actually did not conquer Kosovo but settled. Where is the prooof that Albanians had a country there in any sort of borders?

So how far do we go back now? Do you agree to hand over Bulgaria back?

Correction - the exact famous quote, by which the history will be remembering him:

"I never had a relationship with THAT WOMAN, Ms. Lewinskey!"

Anonymous Aries:
>>>Yes the facts are there The sequence of US actions the State
Departement charaterizing The KLA exactly after the Clinton Sex Scandal and the reckless childish statement " i did not have intercourse ".<<<
===============================

He has a deformed point finger on his left hand. As a lefty, he poked that curved/croocked finger up in the air and in an angree voice, looking streight into camera said: "I never had a relationship with Ms. Lewinskey!" He thought - a 20 year old intern, it'll be [...]

Read the full comment her word against the President's word, who is going to believe her?
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If I was his adviser at the time, I would have told him:

"Mr. President, my advise that you go out in front of TV cameras and make the following statement: "I had 32 blow job sessions in the Oval Office. You people have nothing to do with that. You elected me to be the Commander in Chief and to run the Executive Branch. It is going to be tough to go back inside to face Hillary, but again you have nothing to do with that."
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That advice is the same I've been giving here in every post. It is based on the forensic legal axiom that no mater how smart one is (and Clinton is considered very smart, but immoral to the core guy), he/she cannot concoct a lie into which all the facts could be forced; there will always be a tail, sticking out.
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Had he followed the above advise of mine, that would be the end of his legal troubles. Instead of that, he kept lying...

Well Peggy,
I am afraid that out-breeding is one of the more legitimate ways of country creation - certainly more so than invasion.
Slavs weren't anywhere to be found there up to 4th century and we didn't really invade in a mass invasion style, but family by family, quietly working the land, until we were majorities and could declare independence.
Bulgars and Serbs were basically the barbarians that came and took land from the locals. Bulgaria was Germany for about 150 (360 AD) years as the Visigods made themselves at home there, until they [...]

Read the full comment were kicked out by the Romans (Byzantines), only to create opportunity for the Slavs and countless others to move in and breed.
That stuff happens, and not having children is a nation's way of committing suicide.
Serbia is not alone - Europe is heading that way. Not having children will change the make up as others move in.
You are in Australia, as are half of Bulgarians (outside BG) and the ones home are too messed up to have children.
I have rich friends who have one child and dump it at early daycare to "socialize" ( or to get rid of) so that that child grows up with little sense of family connection, love, and need for closeness - just like the parents, actually... Chances are that that child will not have a large family too.


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Ludvig Boltzmann
<< Do you want links that Grachanica and Pecka Patriarshia (Serbian hollyest sites are in Kosovo? Do you need her to provide you links saying that ALL THE TOWNS, CITIES, RIVERS, MOUNTAINS IN KOSOVO HAVE HAD SERBIAN NAMES (can't you just look at the map?)? Genocide? Do you know the definition of genocide. Kosovo was a low level conflict until Monica Lewinsky emerged. For the 10 years before Monica Lewinsky sex scandal, there were only 2,000 dead in total on both Serbian (police, civilians) and Albanian (terrorist insurgents and civilians). After Monica's sex scandal Clinton administration [...]

Read the full comment decided to bomb and invade Serbia. The predictions were that after first three days of bombing the Serbs were going to collapse. KLA was needed for logistics and translations, and over night in 1998, KLA got a new label "liberation army". Before 1998 U.S. S.D. kept them on the TERRORIST LIST (do you need links for that too?) How could Serbia commit "genocide" of 200/year (just in NYC criminals kill 2,000 innocent people every year!) AGAINST THE CRIMINAL ORGANISATION?
>>
----------------------------------------------------------------------Yes the facts are there The sequence of US actions the State
Departement charaterizing The KLA exactly after the Clinton Sex Scandal and the reckless childish statement " i did not have intercourse ". ___________________________________

Peggy made this clear argument:
>>Albanians have outbred and crossed the border illegally for the past seven decades" pegg

Should we declare certain parts of England and France separate countries simply because migrants from certain parts of the world are a majority in those areas?<<
====================================
This is the answer she got:

>>Links or citations please?

Your ignorance is facinating, comparing oranges with pears.
Do these immigrants share a border with UK or France? Has [...]

Read the full comment the UK or France commited genocides against their own "citizens" since the nazzis showed what genocide is? <<
====================

She gave you common knowledge. Do you want links that Grachanica and Pecka Patriarshia (Serbian hollyest sites are in Kosovo? Do you need her to provide you links saying that ALL THE TOWNS, CITIES, RIVERS, MOUNTAINS IN KOSOVO HAVE HAD SERBIAN NAMES (can't you just look at the map?)? Genocide? Do you know the definition of genocide. Kosovo was a low level conflict until Monica Lewinsky emerged. For the 10 years before Monica Lewinsky sex scandal, there were only 2,000 dead in total on both Serbian (police, civilians) and Albanian (terrorist insurgents and civilians). After Monica's sex scandal Clinton administration decided to bomb and invade Serbia. The predictions were that after first three days of bombing the Serbs were going to collapse. KLA was needed for logistics and translations, and over night in 1998, KLA got a new label "liberation army". Before 1998 U.S. S.D. kept them on the TERRORIST LIST (do you need links for that too?) How could Serbia commit "genocide" of 200/year (just in NYC criminals kill 2,000 innocent people every year!) AGAINST THE CRIMINAL ORGANISATION?
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In G.B. had been killing Irish terrorist (or you want to call them "Irish liberation army" for the last couple hundred years +), who are seeking to liberate their God given Irish land, and you would not call genocide, would you? In France, Algerians and Marocans have been terrorizing France in a low level conflict from time to time. By your definition this would also be a "mini genocide". Because these people flooded France, large number got the legal status, should they be allowed to split from France (your genocide or without what you and propaganda conveniently call genocide)
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So, before the Monica sex scandal, KOSOVO WAS A LOW LEVEL CONFLICT (2,000 TOTAL DEAD FOR 10 PRIOR YEARS) IN THE FIGHT AGAINST THE TERRORIST KLA. After Monica sex scandal came bombing and 10,000 dead on all sides. Compare that with one million dead in total in Iraq War (you would never say that was a genocide, correct?). So "genocide" in Kosovo to justify steeling 15% of Serbia looks a ridiculous argument after all.

"Albanians have outbred and crossed the border illegally for the past seven decades" pegg

Links or citations please?

"Should we declare certain parts of England and France separate countries simply because migrants from certain parts of the world are a majority in those areas?"

Your ignorance is facinating, comparing oranges with pears.
Do these immigrants share a border with UK or France? Has the UK or France commited genocides against their own "citizens" since the nazzis showed what genocide is?


[...]

Read the full comment
"How do you figure that Kosovo is not Serbian. Because Albanians are a majority there now."
How do you determine that Vojvodina is Serbian? becouse of the majority serbs that immigrated there and bread like the swine flu?

"How do you think that situation came about? You just cannot outbreed people in certain areas and then declare independence."

Didnt the servs peasents do that since the 7th centuary? or do you believe that there were was nobody in the balkans? just for your ignorance belgrade is 2200 years old, serviles were not even flees on mongolians back back then.

"That's why majority of the world has not recognised Kosovo as a separate country."

Thats all you got???? the majority of the world? Kosovos neighbours have recognised, 5 of 7 ex yugo republics have recognised. most of the west including japan.

Too bad all you serbs move to countrys that have recognised... you all look patheric. hurray for dictators and blame the people that feed you. pathetic parasites.



"If that was the criteria for a new country then we will see many more conflicts and declarations of independence around the world."

When did they stop??? your rhetoric is truly retarded in every single way. go read a book or something before the heat boils your last hateful braincells.

or go move back to your landlocked cave if you keep blaming the west for the genocides, raping, burning and looting of your fellow "brothers" who get blessed by killer priests and liers who act like victims.

Serbs are just showing every day their backwardness, since yugo fell, they cant steal anymore and are truly uncovered of who they truly are, pathetic loosers. Keep celebrating military loses, thats all you get.

Valeri you say:

"Blaming Serbia - the time for that has pass - still you couldn't expect BG to disrespect everything we've gone through in the last century and support your territorial claims on land populated by others. It's just not happening. It was never going to happen."

Don't worry about blame for past 100 years. You have made yourself perfectly clear. You reserve the right to hold onto that feeling of being betrayed by Serbs for as long as you want. That's fine and I really don't want to change any [...]

Read the full comment of that but you have to respect the fact that Kosovo is Serbian territory no matter who lives there.

Perhaps your idea of who should rule what is dependent on who outbreeds whom on a certain part of any country.
Does it not matter that Kosovo is Serbian land and Albanians have outbred and crossed the border illegally for the past seven decades to become a majority there?

Should we declare certain parts of England and France separate countries simply because migrants from certain parts of the world are a majority in those areas?

How do you figure that Kosovo is not Serbian. Because Albanians are a majority there now. How do you think that situation came about? You just cannot outbreed people in certain areas and then declare independence. That's why majority of the world has not recognised Kosovo as a separate country. If that was the criteria for a new country then we will see many more conflicts and declarations of independence around the world.

Peggy,
I didn't decide anything, because I am just one person.
I am just attempting to explain why is it that the words "stabbed in the back" are not applicable in this case. If you don't know the dynamic from our pov, then surely it may seem that BG stabbed Serbia in the back quite a few times...

Blaming Serbia - the time for that has pass - still you couldn't expect BG to disrespect everything we've gone through in the last century and support your territorial claims on land populated by [...]

Read the full comment others. It's just not happening. It was never going to happen.

Crying over Makedonia is crying over spilled milk - actually the Greeks will have much more trouble with that new country than BG. There is no difference between the Bulgarians living in our part of ancient Macedonia with those living in our part of ancient Thrace - all Bulgarians.
Not so with the Bulgarian speakers in northern Greece because they are just too different from the majority Greeks -linguistically.
FYROM is a truly Yugoslav residue - never mind how they call themselves - the mentality is identical. It's all about us, and them, and my grandfather, your grandmother...
Nothing good will come out of that.

Just understand our historical legacy - in our infancy as a new country after "the Long Night" we got majorly burnt from uniting with some of our neighbors against some others of our neighbors. That shaped us. We learnt that cultural connection, doesn't always mean good intentions. Not to mention that the other catastrophe in the 20th century for BG, came from the Russians - another Slav Orthodox brothers of ours - and their brand communism that we are still recovering from...

20th century was all messed up. EU is beckoning, free travel, a chance for affluence and self respect.

It's not Serbs and Bulgarians but Peggy and Valeri that matter.

Valeri, I am not trying to get you to say something you don't mean. What I am doing is repeating what you are actually saying. The two are very different.

Love and admiration from you we don't need. Support is what we need which you obviously don't think that Serbia deserves. I don't have a problem with that. You can see and justify your decision any way you want and as I pointed out to you earlier that is fine, as long as you don't mind Serbia not supporting you in case you end up with [...]

Read the full comment similar problems.

One thing that I do not agree with you and will fight you on is your statement that Serbia is responsible for how FYROM feels about Bulgaria or if they acknowledge their Bulgarian roots.
If one feels Bulgarian, no amount of swaying in the opposite direction will stop them from feeling. Look at all the slavic speaking Macedonians in Greece. Nothing has made them change. They still claim to be Madenonians and not Greeks. I know, I have met a few. All the instruction they had from Tito to call themselves Yugoslav has not worked and they still call themselves Macedonians and did back in Tito's time. If they considered themselves Yugoslav before Macedonian they would still consider themselves that.

Some do acknowledge their Bulgarian roots. What it is with that? How come Serbia hasn't been able to beat that out of them?

Take a look at the Albanians. They are Albanians whereever they happen to live and nobody is going to change that. So just because some Macedonians don't want to say they are Bulgarian is their own doing and you can stop blaming Serbia for that. FYROM is independent now. Go and sort it out with them. Here is your chance.
I can assure you Serbia will not interfere.

Valeri:

>>Ludvig,
I said that, but not about Peggy. I said it about Bulgarians who support Serbia on that issue.

I think you are confusing "emotional" with "moral". This is basically a real estate dispute. Morality could be subjective, ( I doubt that the Albanians saw themselves as "immoral" in their fight for independence) and I think Serbia pretty much lost the "moral" bit when she tried to expel all those Albanians from there.

All humans are susceptible to emotional response, yet that [...]

Read the full comment almost always ends up working against them. The question of legality is a different one, and on that Serbia has a stronger case. Allowing areas to separate could have thorny consequences for many other countries, with major minority populated areas.
On that the jury is still out and it may come back to bite the "international community" in the hind...<<
==========================

I already said that there were some super-smart people (complicated thinking process) here and i included you as one of that group. We do not have to agree on anything, and for sure something would be terribly wrong, if we agreed on everything, but in any case my above opinion would stand.

Peggy,
you are trying to get me to say something that I wouldn't mean, if I do. As I said, I like Serbs, good friends, fun to party with, and very genuine folks, but there is definitely a mentality difference, probably steaming from our countries different experiences in the last 60 or so years.
The "us and them" is of ubiquitous nature in conversations with my Serb friends. So is their intense patriotism and the almost Homeric, heroic vision of their country. As if Serbia is the hero of a Greek tragedy!

[...]

Read the full comment That is in stark contrast with Bulgarians, who for the most part dislike pretty much everything about their country. Our patriotism, and I am making a vast generalization here, is more complex. This is why it's seemingly easier for us to accept our irreversible blending with the rest of Europe.
I judge by my myself, as my heart loves the Russians, for example, my brain - not so much...

This is not some sort of superiority of BGs way vs Serbia's. This is merely what we all ended up with, after that terrible century before.
As far as "stabbing in the back": If regular Serbs weren't told, of the fact that Makedonia was Bulgarian speaking at the time Serbia, in agreement with Greece, and with the help of Romania, occupied it in the so called "The War of the Allies" or "the Second Balkan War", despite agreements to the contrary, prior the commencement of collective hostilities against Turkey the year before, it would seem that BG stabbed Serbia in the back, every time BG attempted to redress the situation. WWI, WWII and now.

For anyone with a historic inclination, like myself, that is the most predictable thing, so it wouldn't merit the term "stab in the back", which by definition implies an attack from unexpected side..

BG will not, and has not ever supported Serbia in territorial issues, for that very reason. With everything else, which I happen to think is more important, BG will support Serbia, because it's in our interest,,,

Ludvig,
I said that, but not about Peggy. I said it about Bulgarians who support Serbia on that issue.

I think you are confusing "emotional" with "moral". This is basically a real estate dispute. Morality could be subjective, ( I doubt that the Albanians saw themselves as "immoral" in their fight for independence) and I think Serbia pretty much lost the "moral" bit when she tried to expel all those Albanians from there.

All humans are susceptible to emotional response, yet that almost always ends up working against them. The [...]

Read the full comment question of legality is a different one, and on that Serbia has a stronger case. Allowing areas to separate could have thorny consequences for many other countries, with major minority populated areas.
On that the jury is still out and it may come back to bite the "international community" in the hind...

I do not remember who said that Peggy was looking at these serious things from emotional point of view (the topic article is exactly about that, how we Serbs all over the world feel). When they object for "emotional approach", they actually want you to look at it just from one point of view, their view that is not rooted in morals, but "factual situation in the field"/"reality", which comes down to "military might - makes it right" - now you should all get along... "now you should have have a lasting peace (on the occupied land)".. . That is [...]

Read the full comment the point of so called "International Community", i.e. countries that bombed Serbia. HOW COULD WE NOW LEGALIZE THE BOMBING? That is the question now.

I am sorry,but I do not see here any Albanian, Bulgarian FYROM point of view. For instance, you could see Albanian point of view when Albanian President Berisha meets his friend Thachi. They issue a statement that there are no borders between "Kosova" & Albania; THEY ARE - THE SAME PEOPLE! Now you're talking. That is the Albanian point of view. The "International Comunity" point of view is the one that was repeated in Hague again and again by G.B., U.S., France, Germany ... and then ECHOED by Bulgaria, Croatia, Burundi... and that is - THERE ARE TWO PEOPLES HERE, SO CALLED PEOPLES OF "KOSOVA" AND PEOPLE OF ALBANIA. The people of Albania have ac heaved their freedom, and now people of "Kosova" (Albanized name for Kosovo; it's like starting calling the U.S. "Ameriki") are fighting for their freedom/independance.
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There is a legal forensic axiom - no matter how smart you may be, you cannot con concoct a lie into which you would be able to jam all the facts. There would always be some kind of tail sticking out

Valeri, you obviously think that Serbia needs to evolve a bit more before they reach Bulgarian standard.

No matter how you try to explain yourself, your message is always the same. Bulgaria went through so much soul searching to come to this point in evolution while Serbia has to go through the same to reach our standard.

You think a lot of yourself don't you? The anger you say Serbs have is very legitimate. Your anger was much earlier on but our anger is more recent.

If Serbia [...]

Read the full comment did not go through the same olf enemies turning on her as recently as the 90s then we would not still be angry. Simple, but it's hard to put something to rest when it's still in your face. So don't compare your anger being put to rest a long time ago. Serbs also put theirs to rest and Serbs had a lot more to be angry about, like Croat and Muslim crimes in WW2. But then the same enemies went on the murderous path again as recently as the 90s starting the whole evil cycle again.

Serbian anger now comes from the 90s. When you have the same problem in Bulgaria now you can comment on the anger. We'll see how well you would cope given the same situation.

Regardless. BG has always stood for the whole neighborhood's membership. We are geografically dependent on contiguous EU memership especially that of Serbia. Serbia is to the west of us and no one knows better than BG how devastating goegraphical isolation is - as was the case with the Yugoslav wars in the 90s. Frankly most of our criminal elite was created by smuggling goods to Serbia in the embargo years. BG is just now shaking the effect of that criminal period. BG has a long way to
go, but it trully is unrecognizable from 10
years [...]

Read the full comment a go. EUmembership is a good
thing.
Your own government knows that. Or are they western stooges too?

Valeri

This is what our PM said just today:

"The sooner Serbia joins the European Union, the better for the prosperity of the Balkans, Bulgarian Prime Minister Boiko Borissov told journalists in Brussels on December 11 2009. Serbia was a European country and deserved to be part of the European family, said Borissov: "We will stand behind her and help her".

This is what matters.
========================

Hahaha!
Are you that naive? Do you really think that he [...]

Read the full comment came to that thought on his own? He was told to support stealing 15% of Serbia, he sends a hired lawyer (Dimitrov) to parrot the NATO case. The US, GB, Germany, France have already spoken - Serbia should be invited to join EU, what the other 20 little countries are going to say? No!?
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I liked your ending: "This is what matters!" ("Puppet people matter, not the real estate")

BTW Peggy,
all I am saying is that to many of our Serb neighbors, it may look like BG stabbed Serbia in that back.
That is not surprising, because surely you weren't told many things in school.. The Makedonian occupation was huge for us - it set us on out 20th century path of one catastrophe after another - not least because of wrong choices on our part. Regardless, any one who knows that on the same day Serbia took Makedonia, she also took Kosovo - wouldn't expect support from BG. Stabbing someone in the back, [...]

Read the full comment is usually reserve when it's unexpected. This is as predictable as death and taxes.
It's unexpected to the ignorant, but then again, the uninformed are always living in an interesting world...

"You are so much better than Serbs. I told you, we get it."

No Peggy. We are not better. The only difference is time. We went through the same thing early 20th century - agony over the injustice, anger, hate - remember we attacked Serbia twice in both WW wars - that's how much it mattered to us. So I can't sit here and blame you too much, because the only difference is that the Yugoslav experience seems to have served as a time capsule for many of you over there.

We [...]

Read the full comment are simply pass that.

Now there's the EU and as your foreign minister said:

"Jeremic said that EU membership was a central strategic priority for Serbia"

This is what our PM said just today:

"The sooner Serbia joins the European Union, the better for the prosperity of the Balkans, Bulgarian Prime Minister Boiko Borissov told journalists in Brussels on December 11 2009. Serbia was a European country and deserved to be part of the European family, said Borissov: "We will stand behind her and help her".

This is what matters.

Valeri said:

"Because we are not Serbia.

I can understand why Peggy would ask this question, but that's just difference in mentalities. No Bulgarian Government would want to incorporate land, against the will of the people living there."


That's right Valeri. You are so much better than Serbs. I told you, we get it. We understand that you have such distaste for Serbs and would love everyone else to follow you.

Now let's get one thing straight. What you are basically saying [...]

Read the full comment is that Serbia has somehow brainwashed all the Macedonians there to think that they are not Bulgarian. Mass hypnosis is it?

Do you actually think about what you are accsing Serbia of? I agree that many Macedonians are of Bulgarian descent but so do the Macedonians themselves. Serbia is not about shove that information down their throats and rightfully so. We don't give a damn what Macedonians think but obviously you do so I suggest you start enlightening them on that one.

It's about time you stopped blaming Serbia for everything. Take some responsibility and put some responsibility on what Macedonians. If you have a problem with this keep Serbia out of it. You can try to present some real evidence of this brainwashing done by Serbia or stay away from the topic as it only makes you look like a racist without any evidence.

"As Peggy said, if that is the case, why don't you "liberate" your Macedonia, the Serbs could not care less?"

Because we are not Serbia.

I can understand why Peggy would ask this question, but that's just difference in mentalities. No Bulgarian Government would want to incorporate land, against the will of the people living there.

This is why Bulgaria has been pushing (until Gruevski that is) for EU membership of FUROM, so hard. There are still hundreds of thousand folks there that identify themselves as Bulgarian, for [...]

Read the full comment whom EU membership will be an effective re-unification with their kind. Also there are many Bulgarians in Bulgaria, who were kicked out of there by the Serbs and would like to have the legal recourse to reclaim their heritage and properties.

Adding "folks from broken homes", such as ex-Yugoslav areas, (not unlike BG in 1989), to the family of European nations is the only true "enlargement" Bulgaria is interested in.

Ludvig:

"Where did you get that? Who told you that?"

This is what the area looked like before Serbia took over Bulgarian speaking Makedonia and Albanian speaking Kosovo - in the same "stab in the back":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ethnographic_Map_of_Turkey_in_Europe.jpg

"It took 700 milion people military might to bomb Serbia two months, with help of Bulgaria, Albania etc. Then only after they cut the water and electricity to 2 million Belgrade civilians, threatening to sophokate them all if they do not hand them Kosovo, only [...]

Read the full comment then Serbs agreed to sign not a capitulation, but a PEACE PLAN"

That right there is the problem. The heroic Serbia that stood up to the big powers! It's a myth, that will keep on hurting you, if you don't shake it!

Another way to look at it is that NATO didn't even have to put any feet on the ground, before Serbia cried "uncle!". WWI and WWII Serbia got serious beating, as well as in '99, and still haven't learnt that simple lesson: You are not a warrior nation! Serbia was lucky to have her side win twice, the third time - not so much. You are just a small, impoverished, provincial entity, like BG, with a terribly low birth rate and little energy for heroics.

Face it, deal with it, incorporate into the EU and try to get along with your neighbors, Albanians included, because they are not going anywhere.

Valery:
>>Kosovo was majority Albanian in 1910 and it is in 2010. It's the people that count, not the real estate!<<
====================
Please give us any link for your above information. Where did you get that? Who told you that?
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As for people vs. real estate, you know - that is another of your silly unsubstantiated postings. Every country in the World has minority that is a majority in certain towns, municipalities, counties, regions. The I.L. / UN recognizes countries sovereignty (as you [...]

Read the full comment put it - real estate) as a matter of justice and keeping the peace in the world. Only secessions of former colonies were allowed and quickly colonized. Take for instance Quebec and N. Cypress. They were not allowed to secede? If your "theory" (people count, not the real estate), than give us an example who launched that principal and who in the World used it. In other words you are lowering yourself to the level of loose gossipy tangling instead of thinking about it and putting out some LOGICAL argument, that makes sense.
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Since I got your attenton, what do you think about another item. One thing is "people count, not Real estate", forget that for a moment and help us with this question: what do you think about the fact that Albanians were never able to take away and hold not even 1 square foot of Serbian land? It took 700 milion people military might to bomb Serbia two months, with help of Bulgaria, Albania etc. Then only after they cut the water and electricity to 2 million Belgrade civilians, threatening to sophokate them all if they do not hand them Kosovo, only then Serbs agreed to sign not a capitulation, but a PEACE PLAN with UNR 1244, where it was stated that Kosovo is a soveregn part of Serbia under UN control until final settlement is reached and approved by the UN, 1000 Serbian policemen were going to return to be stationed along the Kosovo borders and ethnically cleansed Serbian population about 250,000 people were going to be allowed to return home. Those were all outright lies. NATO, not the UN took real control of Kosovo, not one Serbian policeman was allowed, out of 250,000 only a handful (something like 100 families) were allowed to come back. Hey Valery, what do you think of that practice executed by so called "International Community" (NATO countries claimed that they were = the World)? Isn't it shameful to lie and cheat, no matter who you are? Or maybe you are going to say - do not worry about illegal aggressions, about signing treaties and peace agreements and they doing whatever you want. The Albanians are JUST PEONS. They are "independent" no more no less than Afghanistan, South Osetia and places like that are independant. NATO took the "real estate" not the Albanians (Albanians are just the front). NATO is the Supreme Court of Kosovo. This has nothing to do with your "peoples". It has only to do with "MIGHT MAKES IT RIGHT". NATO countries and leaders did not hide that. Until Obama was elected, the Berns, Willson, Hill and other US administration representatives were coming to Kosovo and Serbia and flatly pronounced fete accompli - there was nothing anyone could do about that. Why? Because we are the might, it is a reality, live with it! Obama today received the Nobel peace price as a conscious of America, who is changing the world for good. He is getting admiration of the entire World, while trying to bring America to her old values - freedom, peoples' dignity, liberty, rule of law, justice for all (unlike the "might makes it right", "puppet-people count not real estate" dudes).

Valeri
>>Why,
Serbia managed to radicalize the Albanians she incorporated in 1913 in the same war she "stabbed BG in the back" and took the Bulgarian speaking Makedonia.<<
================================
~ First "Bulgarian speaking Makedonia". First Peggy, then I pointed out Serbia could not take Macedonia from Bulgaria, only Yugoslavia (Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro, BH could have taken Macedonia, not Serbia alone). That be the case why you keep repeating Serbia took away Bulgarian Macedonia. Serbia could not have taken Macedonia, because Macedonia was on even foot with Serbia. And best [...]

Read the full comment way to convince yourself that you are wrong would be if you ask yourself - OK bad Serbs took Balgarian Macedonia, after the breakup of YU, Macedonia ran away, but they do not want anything to do with you to this day. Your argument that the Serbs again (!!) have managed to turn all the Bulgarians against their alleged motherland, is so silly. As Peggy said, if that is the case, why don't you "liberate" your Macedonia, the Serbs could not care less?
~ As for Serbs "incorporated Albanians in 1913", do you know what % were the Albanians in Kosovo then? What do you think 90%, 80%, 70%... No mam, they had only 25%. Albania did not exist prior to 1913. Check it. Then how Serbia could have incorporated in 1913 the center of its culture (Kosovo) where all the churches date 700 years back, when the Albanian population was a very small minority? Also ask yoursef, is it possible that 100% of the UN recognized the YU in its borders. Colonization of Albanians by the Serbs and Montenegrins was never mentioned until the bombing propaganda was unleashed. And finally, you followed all the arguments in ICTY, nobody (not even mother Albania) mentioned that NATO was fighting the COLONIZER Serbia.

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

Why,
Serbia managed to radicalize the Albanians she incorporated in 1913 in the same war she "stabbed BG in the back" and took the Bulgarian speaking Makedonia.
The Albanians in Albania are much less Muslim, radical, and less criminal, than those Serbia attempted to incorporate in 1913 and throughout the Yugoslavia fiasco.
Basically, with the help of the western powers, Serbia, in the 20th century, attempted to fill the shoes of an Empire, by incorporating various nationals under Belgrade's umbrella.
The problem of course, was and is, that Serbia is essentially just [...]

Read the full comment a small provincial entity, like BG, that doesn't have the mature institutions needed for such an endeavor. The result was catastrophic, as we saw with those embarrassing, 19th century style, land wars in the 1990s. That my friend will be the gift that will keep on giving to the whole area of my neighborhood, unfortunately. You have Albanians who are looking to Mecca for leadership, and our poor Makedonian, formerly Bulgarian relatives down there - Alexander the Great if you please! How sad and pathetic is that!

Why:
"Guess what, Serbia will then recognize the chunk of land that they will take."

That would be fine! If the land is majority Albanian or Turk, why would we want to rule over it? A nation that doesn't have children cannot blame others for getting elbowed out of her real estate. Serbia took by force and treachery Bulgarian populated lands, and losing millions of your nationals to a neighbor bent on erasing their identity, is much worse than losing land with very few of your nationals on it, as was the case in Kosovo.
Kosovo was majority Albanian in 1910 and it is in 2010. It's the people that count, not the real estate!

I think you guys better get on with the program - what's needed here is EU incorporation, not land greed or figuring the difference between Alexander and Aristotle...

What a bad move Bulgaria! You do know that the Albanians are moving towards your country as well, right? What will happen when they settle into your 'friendly' environment? Guess what, Serbia will then recognize the chunk of land that they will take. Or perhaps Turkey, you're nice and close to them. Very sad that you would recognize criminals and savages who pulled the wool over the eyes of the world. You have Orthodox churches as well don't you? We had several thousand ancient churches in Kosovo... the occupying Albanian Muslims have burned down or vandalized several hundred of them. [...]

Read the full comment Now Saudi Arabia has moved in and provided funds for Mosques. Maybe you take some of the Saudis cash as well now.

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained foul, abusive or discriminating language

Agron Forlani

Thu, Dec 10 2009 07:33 CET

"Peggy all does words will be for serbs not for albanians .... You are such evill Peggy shame an you ....O i forget one think nobody blames you PEGGY ,cuz you are serbian ."


Do you actually have something to say or do you just suffer from verbal diarrhoea?

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained foul, abusive or discriminating language

Peggy all does words will be for serbs not for albanians .... You are such evill Peggy shame an you ....O i forget one think nobody blames you PEGGY ,cuz you are serbian .

Bulgaria Stabs Serbia in Back

Montenegro Stabs Serbia in the back

Macedonia, Croatia Slovenia Hungary

Why does not serbia understand that its not Stab in the back its just reality.

old proverb: If one person tells you that u drunk no worry, if 2 , 4 , 6 friends tell u are drunk hold for the railing U are.

So Serbia what do u need to get that kosovo is not going back to get the point?

Ludvig - thanks for describing the Harvard method of working. The "magnification caricature" method stretching the phenomenon under study to both extremes is certainly unusual, though I can see why it might work. (FYI, it is not so far used in Cambridge , England.)

There is an approximate analogy in earlier Physics, i.e. to test a steam boiler to see at what point (under positive steam pressure) it explodes, or under negative water pressure , to see at which point it implodes. Sounds like much the same principle; in the 'steam' case the results - though [...]

Read the full comment instructive - were not always respected by railway/railroad engineers.

The results of this caused several spectcular accidents in both US and Europe.

There must be a moral here somewhere....

"Turning to Peggy, it's amazing what some women can do with a "limp piece of lettuce", especially with a battery attached !"

Really! Speaking from experience?

Who really cares? Move on leave the past in the past. Its just what Europe needs, another third rate Balkan country.

@Limp piece of lettuce

>>Ludvig B -
Your argument about the Hungarians in Romania is slightly inaccurate geographically - their minority in actually evenly spread around Transylvania, not just within the 'judets' of Szekely. True, the
Hungarian government would dearly like to re-open the 1919 Treaty of Trianon so as to re-acquire Transylvania from an incompetent Romanian government, but that's history.....<<
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Thanks for the correction. Point well taken. If you never attended Harvard, let me describe a graduate class moment over there. Picture a [...]

Read the full comment small, intimate amphitheater, good looking bunch of students (average grade: A, mostly former valedictorians)students, all colors and races, in front of each student is a plate (attached to the table) with student's name in large capital letters, so that everyone could see. Professor, often not much older than the students is running up and down the aisles, prodding, provoking... Why am I telling you all this? You struck me as a thinking person (regardless whether we agree, or not on a given issue), that could see an intrinsic point. Whatever the subject is - various scientific methods are being used, such as "magnification/ caricature" method, or "lock and free method". The second more known; it is the most important in applied physics, but the first one is applicable on our (between the two of us) discussion here. Namely, on purpose (in my case it was unknowingly) you STRETCH the given/tested phenomenon toward the both extremes in order to see the trend better, clearer. Then you bring it back into the realistic realm, scope, where the rough edges are being cut and further polished...The participants are encouraged to exaggerate on purpose toward the both extremes. The result is much better contrasted final conclusion, proposed solution.

Aries,
Thanks friend. You know, I have a theory, that only happy people are truly polite. That makes you - a happy person.

apologies to all Serbs. We Bulgarians dont feel like that.

to hell with Albania

Ludvig B -

Your argument about the Hungarians in Romania is slightly inaccurate geographically - their minority in actually evenly spread around Transylvania, not just within the 'judets' of Szekely. True, the
Hungarian government would dearly like to re-open the 1919 Treaty of Trianon so as to re-acquire Transylvania from an incompetent Romanian government, but that's history.....

There was also until very recently a German minority in Transylvania too, but they managed to get themselves repatriated into unified Germany very quickly in 1991. Smart folk, the Volksdeutsche Germans...for once smarter [...]

Read the full comment than the Hungarians (whose ability in revolving doors is otherwise legendary in Central Europe !)

Turning to Peggy, it's amazing what some women can do with a "limp piece of lettuce", especially with a battery attached !

@Ludvig Boltzmann
Really a pleasure to see an analytic mind distributing energy
in a quite statistical manner
Carry on but caution on who can handle and who can't >>Truth<<

USA-Bulgaria

Tue, Dec 08 2009 07:11 CET

"Move on...get out of the box. Don't live with the past, learn from it! The war was bad. Unfortunately, many good serbs have to go through all this in order to move on and have a better life...The war is over. Yugoslavia lost. The people won!"

Nobody lives more in the past than the Albanians and here you are giving Serbs advice.
Why don't you get out of stone age, tribal feuds and breeding like rabbits to see [...]

Read the full comment how the rest of civilised Europe lives?

Why don't you drop your Illyrian myth, become decent people who don't steal other people's territories before you presume to know it all?

Why don't you stop your lust for blood and human organs and step into 21st century?

There is a lot you can do before you are allowed to preach.

Move on...get out of the box. Don't live with the past, learn from it! The war was bad. Unfortunately, many good serbs have to go through all this in order to move on and have a better life...The war is over. Yugoslavia lost. The people won!

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained foul, abusive or discriminating language

Serbs are funny:
>>Short-sighted a bit, aren't we? If Serbia wants to make it into the EU, should they really be hurling insults at countries that can block them?<<
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If Bulgaria were in any position to block anybody, it would not do what is being doing these days. One prominent paper in the U.S. called Tony Blair Bush's "spit bucket carrier". All the way to the end the British press referred to him as "Bush's lapdog". That is how much G.B. had a power of deciding the global course. Now, where do [...]

Read the full comment you place Bulgaria on that scale? Let you be the judge.

Morning:

>>According to the major western international powers this issue is closed, so there is no point to pay any attention to such reviving of the arguments from Serbia.<<
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You don't even know, where you are.

Palko Shmatkata,
You even managed to argue with yourself. carry on!

Prishtina:

>>Well done Buldaria, thank you. Straightforward! This is needed. As soon as you say the truth no worries for anything else. << Truth? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!

answer:
>>the example with the hungarian minority in Romania is not the same with Kosovo...hungarian minority in Romania is mostly located(80%) in the middle of the country called Szekely region...<< And your point is? Nothing in the World is the same. Kosovo is a unique case, so say the "humanitarian bombers". Isn't every conflict, every country, every person in the world unique? So what? If one/something is a unique person, unique town, village, that does not mean that that person/entity does not have to obey the Natural Laws, Moral standards, International Law and so forth.
[...]

Read the full comment

Valeri:
>>BG will support Serbia in her development, EU integration and everything else, except in territorial acquisition - that would be silly to expect.<<
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You got the things in reverse - it is NATO that is plundering/ grabbing by brute force 15% of the Serbian holly land (large free military base - Drang nach Osten, alter Schlaviner'....). "Acquisition"! That's a good one.

"zoran":

>>I am shame to call myself serb..<<
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Cheap, childish (Albanian & Co.), gimmick

Constructive or not, this was a stupid move to support Kosovo independence.
Just think that Bulgaria is surrounded with Serbia, Romania and Greece, all of them strongly opposing the Kosovo independence. Is it an example of good neighbour or act of stupidity to support Kosovo independence? Is there any real benefit in it for Bulgaria or simply it is an act of loyalty for some local politicians towards their sponsors?.

the example with the hungarian minority in Romania is not the same with Kosovo...hungarian minority in Romania is mostly located(80%) in the middle of the country called Szekely region...

I always find it interesting how few Serbs are actually aware of their relationship with BG. To say that you were "stabbed in the back", implies a background of friendship and cooperation, shuttered by an act of betrayal.
Since 1913 Serbia and BG have not had a good relationship starting with the loss of Makedonia to Serb aggression, and its purging of anything Bulgarian including even the ending of their names.
In fact BG's taking the side of Germany in both WWs was directly connected to an attempt to redress Serbia's territorial acquisition at BGs expense. [...]

Read the full comment For the Serbs to expect Bulgarian support in territorial issues of all things, speaks of historical ignorance. BG will support Serbia in her development, EU integration and everything else, except in territorial acquisition - that would be silly to expect.

Incredibly agressive nation.
I am not sure Serbia is ready yet to cooperate peacefuly in the EC.
It seems that all pro-serbia here are even against it ... Well, if you don't mind EC, EC does not mind you either.
And to answer to Aegean King : if Greece had to bring anything new to the World, we would certainly be aware of it ...

Serbs are passionate people, more passionate than most. This is both their greatest strength and greatest weakness. To say that Bulgaria once again stabbed Serbia in the back is not constructive. I want to remind my Bulgarian friends that, in reality, the Serbian statement is not against Bulgaria as it is an internal political move by the Serb elite to unify it's people in defense against externalizes. It is a move to fortify identity against threats. This is Serbia's natural way of preparing for a fight. Tito and Milosovich used this sensationalism in the past effectively. The passion of the [...]

Read the full comment Serbs was manipulated and they were the only Slavs which stood up and fought Hitler, Stalin, and the US, an impressive, albeit not at all times correct engagement. Saying Bulgaria stabbed Serbia in the back is not constructive. Thank you Chipperfield, I was thinking the same timeline as I first read the title of this article. As a Bulgarian I would hope that our Serbian cousins take a constructive approach to this development, I would also question our government on the legality of recognizing Kosovo. The ultimate result should be for the betterment of people's lives, not the preservation of borders - this leads me to believe that recognizing an independent Kosovo maybe less harmful than not. I also agree that unity in Slavdom is most beneficial to those who call themselves Slavs. Unfortunately our histories, cultures, and at times backwardness has made this task extremely hard.

Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

That was by far the most comical serbian comment in a long history of comical serb moves to undermine slavic unity. Bravo for Valev for bringing in the Serbian back-stabbing in the past few hundred years and bravo to Chipperfield to pointing out that the serbs had many historical opportunities to bring forth the flower of pan-slavi unity but their imperious nationalism and narrow self-interest always destroys everything--JUST LIKE THIS LATEST COMMENT TO BULGARIA. The dream of Europe without borders and being united will always be undermined by the Serbs, maybe they should be shipped off the continent to Afghanistan [...]

Read the full comment perhaps and see how they fare in a larger sea of unmitigated tribalism...

That crowd in Belgrade have been nothing but a pain in the world's butt since the day Gavrilo Princip shot the Archduke. No one cares what they think about anything. The entire Yugoslavia has been dismantled and the former Yugoslavian Republics don't seem to be doing too badly on their own...As opposed to Serbia itself, which remains a mess.

Dušan Bataković, "believes that Bulgaria, as many times in history so far, has stuck a knife in Serbia’s back, by defending the secession of Kosovo".

Short-sighted a bit, aren't we? If Serbia wants to make it into the EU, should they really be hurling insults at countries that can block them? Come on, Serbs, let's see a little groveling before the Bulgarians... You know how it's done, you've been kissing Russia's a** for centuries.

I am shame to call myself serb..

Robert, which country did you graduate in?
You say it is an Orthodox country but you don't say which one.
It matters.

According to the major western international powers this issue is closed, so there is no point to pay any attention to such reviving of the arguments from Serbia.

Greece stands with Serbia...

Bravo Bulgaria! All of us in Macedonia are behind you. Long LIve the Bulgarians of Ohrid!

Bulgaria paid off by USA. Bulgarians have no integrity! Would sell their own mother, like a goat.

u know u can move a goat herder to EU lets say and they will still be a goat herder ...lets be 101 % clear on that ...money , EU handicapped entry, none of that matter ..money doesnt buy class!! and u'll be goat herders until serbia says u no longer are !!

USA-Bulgaria
>> All the other countries, like Romania, Greece, China, Russia, etc. do not recognize Kosovo because they have their own problems, regions that want to be independant, Romania has problems with some regions next to Moldova, Greece with Cyprus, China with Taiwan, Russia has many provincve like Chechnia....If they decide to support Kosovo, that means they will give a green light to their own regions for indepandance..<<
-----------------------------
You answered your own dilemma. You cannot understand someone else's pain, unless it touches you. In Romania, for instance, there is a large Hungarian [...]

Read the full comment minority along the common border w/ Hungary (analogous to the Albanian minority population along the borders w/ Serbia, Montenegro, and Greace (all according to the Albanians should be "liberated"). Why not cut a piece of Romania and form Hungary #2, or deed it to Hungary, as a shortcut? And then you Bulgarians could high-five with the Hungarians all day long? Why not? Why are the Albanians an elite minority, a unique case in the history of the World as Mr. Dimitrov "proved" it in his "legal argument" (according to him, said uniqueness comes from the fact that NATO got involved!)

USA-Bulgaria
>> All the other countries, like Romania, Greece, China, Russia, etc. do not recognize Kosovo because they have their own problems, regions that want to be independant, Romania has problems with some regions next to Moldova, Greece with Cyprus, China with Taiwan, Russia has many provincve like Chechnia....If they decide to support Kosovo, that means they will give a green light to their own regions for indepandance..<<
-----------------------------
You answered your own dilemma. You cannot understand someone else's pain, unless it touches you. In Romania, for instance, there is a large Hungarian [...]

Read the full comment minority along the common border w/ Hungary (analogous to the Albanian minority population along the borders w/ Serbia, Montenegro, and Greace (all according to the Albanians should be "liberated"). Why not cut a piece of Romania and form Hungary #2, or deed it to Hungary, as a shortcut? And then you Bulgarians could high-five with the Hungarians all day long? Why not? Why are the Albanians an elite minority, a unique case in the history of the World as Mr. Dimitrov "proved" it in his "legal argument" (according to him, said uniqueness comes from the fact that NATO got involved!)

Bulgaria ‘again stabbed Serbia in the back’, Belgrade says

and the loosers continue

'We are not pathetic criminals' Belgrade says


'We dont give fake passports for serbian rats to flee and avade justice' Belgrade says

'we are orthodox' Belgrade says

'we didnt start wars and commited genocide, including killing unarmed civilians including elderly, woman and children'Belgrade says

'we did not commit the greatest genocide in eu since the nazzis' Belgrade says

[...]

Read the full comment /> 'we love peace and equal rights in servila' Belgrade says


notice the patern there, the 'victimised serbs are nothing but pathetic crocodile tears

prggy and his sidekick kmilan.

stop wearing out the orthodox name, you are very far from them. the closest you can get to is foundemental extremists. as for your own brotherhood, you pathetic excuses for ethnic nationalism are jumping from branch to branch like monkeys for anything that would make you look better. but you wont find none so you will jump again.

loosers again serbia

Yes, Peggy! I am an Orthodox, I am a graduate of an Orthodox Seminary and of a School of Theology in an Orthodox country. And I have studied at King's College in London and at St. Augustin in Warminster - was it in Wiltshire, near the Stonehenge? but now I am far away from England.
Islam is not a religion of peace.
Read more history and you will see. Did you hear the latest where a suicide moslem bomber exploded
his bombs in a mosque and killed a hundred of his own people? Since [...]

Read the full comment you are in England, try to find the writings of William Gladstone
and you may see how peaceful Islam is. The truth is that in every religion you will find the good and the bad - the saints and the sinners. You may know of Henry
VIII and his Act of Settlemnt of 1833 when he proclaimed himself as
Pope, head of the Church of England (Thomas Moore told him that he could be anything, but a Pope he could not be - and had his head chopped off) and proceeded to behead his wives. Then you may cross to
Europe and visit the religious wars of the 16th century and, of course, the 30 years war of the 17th century. This is a very long story to continue it.

Koinos said:

"Tough Tit", as they say in the north of England.....

I don't know why that reminded me of Peggy (!),"

This argument is a limp as an old piece of lettuce. I don't know why this reminds of of Kounos but..

Robert, you seem to think to know a lot about Orthodox churches. Did you study this somewhere or are you only spreading crap? How much do you know about Orthodox churches?

I see, the only good Orthodox [...]

Read the full comment church is the one which is ready to sell out the rest of them like Bulgarian. Yep, that's a good trait to have in a place of worship.
What do you think of Vatican then? Popes seem to enjoy travelling around the wold telling us all what to think. They do a lot more than any Orthodox church does.

How about Islam. Now there is a religion of peace. We've all soon footage of what happens in your England. We've all seen those marches and signs saying death to all who insult Islam.

I guess they are all wonderful except the Russian, Serbian and Greek Orthodox church because you simply cannot stomach people wanting to unite and defend against a common enemy.

Whatever your religion is, it must be wonderful then. It's good to be you.

Why did one person of the Bulgarian government say that they were supporting the ILLEGAL separation of KOSOVO from SERBIA? I don't think that we know how the majority of BULGARIANS think about it. After WW1 BULGARIA was offered by the government in Belgrade to unify with Yugoslavia in the name of Slavic Unity. But the government in Sofia said that they could never be ruled from Belgrade.

Peggy has raised the qustion of religion and enjoys the prospects of Bulgarians forsaking Orthodoxy, to separate from the Orthodox nations - Serbs, Greeks, Russians
et al. True, the Orthodox churches, all of them, have fallen into the heresy of chauvinism, which is one notch beyond nationalism. In 1872 the Greek
Patriarchate in Constantinople -
sporting the title of "Ecumenical"
then and now - excommunicated the Bulgarians for the heresy of philetism (tribalism, nationalism)
which the Greeks practiced as true Orthodoxy. Then, and now, the
Orthodox churches have [...]

Read the full comment failed to cope with the challenge of nationalism, all Orthodox churches have become intruments in the hands of secular
politicians and have departed from true Orthodox Christianity. The qustion which all of them have to answer is, whether their nationalism-chauvinism fits with the principle of JUSTICE for all,
which is fundamental to Christianity. If they violate this principle they are captives of a ideology of paganism.

The Serbs have a saying: "I Bog ou
nebo, i one e Srb. He is served by
Serbian angels." In 1914 Alexander Stamboliysky (He is the last one to be dubbed as anti-Serbian" deliverd a speech in the parliament and, pointing that Serbian kids were taught in school to sing a song to this refren, said: "Such a barbarian stupidity (divotia) will not be heard in Bulgaria."

Bulgarians need not abandone Orthodoxy on account of its distortion by anybody. The Orthodox theology, liturgical practices and traditions, especially the Liturgy served in Western type of chanting, is superior to all Chrisian and world
religions. One should only attend
service in Alexander Nevsky to confirm our appreciation.

Sure, much in Orthodox traditions needs signifficant reforms. Sure, the Orthodox leadership - the Bulgarian and all orthodox churches - is frozen in medieval traditions, and unable for reforms, but it may be forced by historical circumstances to move ahead and adapt itself to modern standarts. In the first place to forsake the chauvinism which is strangling it.

I do think Valev has a point - Serbia has not behaved at all well towards the Bulgarians over the years, so it can expect scant support now. "Tough Tit", as they say in the north of England.....

I don't know why that reminded me of Peggy (!),but I should remind her that the correct date for expressing Orthodox Christmas wishes is no earlier than January 1st, as Orthodox Christmas falls on January 6th/7th. So it is premature to express them now, in early December.

yeah, even the masters of the siptartds love them soooo much that they abolished visas for serbia, but not for albanians !
now albaniacs cry for serbian passports again ! but NO THANKS , no more parasites running around with serbian passports !
ALL siptards should move back to turkey peacefully ! MUP and VS will give assistance !

Weldone Mr Chipperfield for reminding us all our bitter experience with the serbs!!
Thank you !
==========================
Robert Chipperfield

Sat, Dec 05 2009 23:05 CET

Inappropriate comment?
Why the Serbs are so upset about Bukgaria's recognition of Kossovo?
Do they remember how many times they have stabbed Bulgaria in the back? Let us remind them&

- In 1885q, when the Bulgarians
declared unification of North and South Bulgaria, who marched to war against Bulgaria? Not the [...]

Read the full comment Turks, but the Serbs. They were badly beaten and if it was not Austria-Hungary to save them, the Bulgarians would have taken Belgrade.

- in 1912, when the Bulgarians fought the Turks to Constantinople,
who joined with the Greeks to deprive Bulgaria of its part in Macedonia? The Serbs, with the
Greeks and the Rumanians despoliled Bulgaria.

- In 1919 who cut off Bulgaria the Western slices of Bulgarian territory? The Serbs did.

After 1913 Who declared the Macedonian Bulgarians to be "Souith Serbians" and changed their names to end on ich instead on ov? The Serbs did!


We could go even back to the days after San Srefano (1878). Who was poised to take Sofia and refused to return behind the Nish-Pirot-Vrania line? The Serbs did.

And today: Who still claims Church jurisdiction of Bulgarian Macedonia? The Serbs do.

No! This writer does not like the way things are in the Balkans, especially between Serbs and Bulgarians, but it is the Serbs who brought things to that point.

All best Bulgarian leaders before the Liberation in 1878 looked to
common cause with the Serbians - to take Rakovski, to take Karavelov - but behind their backs the Serbs ploted with the Greeks to despoil the Bulgarians.

So, it is better the Serbs keep quiet and not raise a qusteion
who stabbed whom in the back.

The biggest problem of serbs is their supernationalism and their strange need to dig the past. "In the year 1642 his ancestor killed my grandgrangrandgrandgrand...father, so I have to be angry for him". This is modern world, this is now. There is no such things like orthodox brothers or slavic unity. Go forward!

tr3 zotet

Sun, Dec 06 2009 05:14 CET

"All I can say to Bulgarian government, well done on cutting yourself off from your Orthodox brothers" Peggy

Go wash your mouth with soap you fascist ignorant. Bringing religion to protect your genocide commiters. You are pathetic and all the ultra ethnic nationalist like yourself.

Gee, did I use a naughty word?
Perhaps the word Orthodox is poinson to our Albanians posters here but too bad.
I can tell you to [...]

Read the full comment do a lot worse but I won't stoop to your level.
Have a great Christmas.

To tr3 zozet havent you got a few goats to look after we need cheese! Your government has shot itself in the foot and you know it. You live with the most corrupt government in Europe hence why they stall giving money to you peasants.

in court ?? bugarski?? WOW ..dont they have some goats to herd or sheep to shave or something who's looking after the farm while this was happening !!!!!

Its pathetic how the Serb in here disguise themself under religious and international names, ashamed to be seen for what they truly are, pathetic loosers in respect to Kosovo. You still lie and fabricate. As for the religious site, your people the Serbs have commited genocides against all, Christians Muslims and yur own kind too. Who killed youe Djindic, or the UN workers or.... it could go on. Serbs are the chame of the Balkans, thank god they are contained in that landlocked cave to minimise their criminality driven brainwashed head.

well done Bulgaria!
The people in Kosovo deserve their independance. It's not going to be easy, but they will do just fine. All the other countries, like Romania, Greece, China, Russia, etc. do not recognize Kosovo because they have their own problems, regions that want to be independant, Romania has problems with some regions next to Moldova, Greece with Cyprus, China with Taiwan, Russia has many provincve like Chechnia....If they decide to support Kosovo, that means they will give a green light to their own regions for indepandance..

Where are the Bulgarian people? This is an outrage!!! Have they gone mad! I feel very sorry for the Bulgarian people.

Bulgarians should now become muslims after helping their Albanian brothers. Both of them sided with Nazi Germany during WW2. Bulgarians are not true Christians. Shame on you for stabbing your brother in the back!

Who sided with the Germans in both World Wars Bulgaria. History of fighting for the wrong side and cause. Bulgaria wake up to yourself shame on you!

Dear "From Bulgarina Plovdiv to Serbian Prizren"

Its a shame how low your kind of ethnic nationalists will sink to in order to deceive and misionform others. I guess as a Serb you have countles fists of propaganda in your head. A sad scenario for you to hate your self enough to pretend you are something that you will never be, as long as you support genocide commiters and act like sad grandmothers that complain in all directions

"All I can say to Bulgarian government, well done on cutting yourself off from your Orthodox brothers" Peggy

Go wash your mouth with soap you fascist ignorant. Bringing religion to protect your genocide commiters. You are pathetic and all the ultra ethnic nationalist like yourself.

Why are Serbs such saw loosers?
All through history all you are proud of is the celebrations of defeats and retreats. Grow up and move one.

It really is a shame how big empires have torn the southern slavs against eachother. It is true that Serbia and Bulgaria have continually stabbed eachother in the back in history. This was all done to keep us from uniting into a real and poweful force. Just look at how strong Bulgaria, Romania, Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro were in the Balkan wars of 1912. We defeated and forced the Ottoman empire OUT OF EUROPE. We probably would have been able to recapture Constantipole if it wasn't for the big powers of Russia, Germany, and others in turning us against each [...]

Read the full comment other. Divide and Conquer! it has been a timeless formula that never fails. That is why in these times of need the Orthodox brothers, as well as the other southern slavs need to stand together as one. Romania has not recognized kosovo, neither has Greece. Only Bulgaria. While Yugoslavia did not include Bulgaria, the idea of a Balkan federation is timeless and much better than any European Union who only looks out for its own interests and not those of others.

Thank you so much Bulgaria. Time will pass and people will remember that when things got tuff you guys did the right thing. We Kosovars will always rember you and will be always to your side when ever you need us. Justice will be served once and for all. Peggy shame on you for trying to put religion in Between as a christian myself I know that is wrong to say what you did, religion has nothing to do with this.

for a state to be strong it need to have see serbs have ben fightin for 500jeears for that and are stel landlocket and this time for god what has serbia to be praud of nathink only think thay cann du to be to atract foreang visyters is if thay follov slovakia make belgrade the capital of cheap prostites of europe hahahaha

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained foul, abusive or discriminating language

All I can say to Bulgarian government, well done on cutting yourself off from your Orthodox brothers. This will not be overlooked by Serbs, Russians, Greeks and others who don't think that stabbing your brother in the back is a good thing.

Bulgaria will find itself partnered with Albanians and Turks again. Who will help you then?

People of Bulgaria, you must correct this huge mistake before it is too late.

i am in UK but why dont i watch you in cam??

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

Bulgaria is a puppet of the more powerful EU members and this is coupled with a huge amount of state corruption.

I find it ironic though that k.albanians continually revel in the provocation of serbs when they should be worrying about their own future.

A complete non-functioning region has been created that will never be able to gain acceptance into any major organisations as China and Russia will forever be permanent security council members.

Serbia, though perenially politically inept, is slowly making its way towards the EU. Kosovo [...]

Read the full comment can never even begin the process without UN recognition.

It will forever remain an isolated ghetto like 'northern cyprus'.

This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained off-topic content

Outrageous for Serbia to claim that Bulgaria has "stuck a knife in Serbia's back"! How many times has Serbia gladly stolen territory and population that truly belonged to Bulgaria, especially during the Balkan Wars. Bulgaria only wanted what was RIGHTFULLY hers, i.e., San Stefanska Bulgaria, the REAL Bulgaria (at the time) as adnmited by the ruling Turks themselves in their imperial census!

Greater Serbia is what Serbs claim is true, Greater Romania is what Romanians say is true, Greater Greece is what Greeks claim is true, but only Bulgarians have the ultimate test of truth to [...]

Read the full comment back up their claims: their occupier, the Turks, ADMITTED in their own imperial census what territory was majority Bulgarian, and that is San Stefanska Bulgaria!

Mr. Chipperfield: I do not accept that argument when applied to the inner cities of America. I do not accept that the violent Negro faction should be allowed to break away and rule our inner cities just because the majority whites fled. Why not? Because this occurred within living memory, and the critical fact, of course, remains that the central government never tried to give up its attempts at controlling the ghetto (whether it was successful is a separate issue) .

I may be wrong, of course, but I believe the same situation occurs in Kosovo. [...]

Read the full comment Yes, the Serbs seemed to abandon their own self-professed spiritual homeland. The issue is at what point does this abandonment become permanent?

The English common law rule is at, what is it, 20 or 21 years of adverse possession? (then the occupier has rightful title to the land if the original owner failed to prosecute his rights during the 20 or 21 year period)?

And who says the Serb population did not try to protect their rights through the central Yugoslav government? I'll wager they did enough to pass muster in any English-speaking court.

Dear fellow readers: My apologies. I inadvertently said two posts that "Kosovo is an integral part of Kosovo." Well, obviously, that was a ridiculous mistake.

I obviously meant to say that Kosovo is (and should remain) an integral part of Serbia.

I am a private American citizen, but I TOTALLY disagree 180 degrees opposite with my own government on this issue. They are wrong!

To Herx:

Serbia lost its legitimate claims
in Kssovo when the Serbs fled away and the Albanians moved in. It is the ethnicity of the population in
any region, not historical memories. Democracy has no chance where one ethnic group dominates an overwhelmig majority of other ethnic group. This is what pre-war Yugoslavia was and this is why it fell apart. The Serbs lost a golden opportunity to create a Balkan state with "liberty and justice for all"

Mr. Robert Chipperfield: Thank you, sir, for the history lesson which needs to be told, how the Serbs, along with all the other Christian neighbors , stabbed Bulgaria in the back after their mutual war for independence against Turkey.

Bulgaria only wanted exactly what she was entitled to at that time, i.e., the the territories even the Ottoman Turks admitted in their imperial census were PREDOMINANTLY BULGARIAN. I English law, this is called an "admission against self interest" (by the Turks), which means it is eminently believable.

Many Balkan countries pretend to [...]

Read the full comment be greater than they currently are, but only Bulgaria, to my humble knowledge, has an opponent (the Turks) admitting what the Bulgarians' rightful territory was at the time, i.e., San Stefanska Bulgaria.

In spite of my well deserved harsh criticism of Serbia during its militant Milosevic days, I TOTALLY AGREE with Serbia that Kosovo is an integral part of Serbia's territory, and the outside world has absolutely NO right to intervene in Serbia's internal affairs. Kosoavo is an integral part of Kosovo, case closed!

Why the Serbs are so upset about Bukgaria's recognition of Kossovo?
Do they remember how many times they have stabbed Bulgaria in the back? Let us remind them&

- In 1885q, when the Bulgarians
declared unification of North and South Bulgaria, who marched to war against Bulgaria? Not the Turks, but the Serbs. They were badly beaten and if it was not Austria-Hungary to save them, the Bulgarians would have taken Belgrade.

- in 1912, when the Bulgarians fought the Turks to Constantinople,
who joined with [...]

Read the full comment the Greeks to deprive Bulgaria of its part in Macedonia? The Serbs, with the
Greeks and the Rumanians despoliled Bulgaria.

- In 1919 who cut off Bulgaria the Western slices of Bulgarian territory? The Serbs did.

After 1913 Who declared the Macedonian Bulgarians to be "Souith Serbians" and changed their names to end on ich instead on ov? The Serbs did!


We could go even back to the days after San Srefano (1878). Who was poised to take Sofia and refused to return behind the Nish-Pirot-Vrania line? The Serbs did.

And today: Who still claims Church jurisdiction of Bulgarian Macedonia? The Serbs do.

No! This writer does not like the way things are in the Balkans, especially between Serbs and Bulgarians, but it is the Serbs who brought things to that point.

All best Bulgarian leaders before the Liberation in 1878 looked to
common cause with the Serbians - to take Rakovski, to take Karavelov - but behind their backs the Serbs ploted with the Greeks to despoil the Bulgarians.

So, it is better the Serbs keep quiet and not raise a qusteion
who stabbed whom in the back.

Sung: There is NO SUCH THING as "Slavic unity". Look at how the Serbs happily attacked the Slovenes and the Croats after both rightfully declared independence from Yugoslavia. I notice that the Serbs only attack neighbors who are smaller than them. Great courage, Serbs!

I admonish my Slovak neighbors, who, BTW, were very sympathetic towards Serbia during President Clinton's bombing of Milosevic's militant Serbia, that the ONLY reason Serbia did not attack Slovakia was because they were not next door neighbors. Note: Slovakia is only half Serbia's size re population, so of course the Serbs would [...]

Read the full comment have militantly picked on a smaller neighbor, as they have proven they do.

Serbians in the EU? I'm not so sure. Maybe wait 3 generations until their blood mad nationalism dies down.

I repeat, Sung: There is no such thing, and there will never be such a thing, nor does there deserve to be such a thing as "Slavic unity"! Try telling your BS to the Poles! They will have none of it.

yeah, even the masters of the siptartds love them soooo much that they abolished visas for serbia, and want to keep albanians out !
now albaniacs cry for serbian passports again ! but NO THANKS , no more parasites running around with serbian passports !

serbia need to be nuklear bombet thet way we in balkans all wuld live in peace get ready for vojvodina becouse she will go without a war and thet will make my day wen i lock in the map for serbia and see only belgrade pashalok in it

bulgaria will do what ever they say the top EU countries and no one will listen to the serbians.

serbia is getting very small every day, lost kosovo and now they will loose province of vojvodina.anyway where is serbia in the map??nowhere to be seeing. they lost everything they had stupid serbs.. bulgaria well done if you want to be part of EU economy.GONE ENGLAND

I was in Serbian Prizren, I saw the Albanian immigrants burning down orthodox churches! I appologize for the behavior of our corrupt government!

It seems that we Bulgarians forgot that in the union with Serbia, Montenegro and Greece during Balkan wars in the beginning of the 20th century we finally free our country from the Ottoman Empire!

And now we support Albanian immigrants in Kosovo to reastablish the Ottoman Empire? I just remember what the turkish foreign minister announced while beeing in the Balakans! He is seeking for a new Turkish Empire. [...]

Read the full comment

Well done, my country of Bulgaria! We support this process!

And sorry to Serbia! Real Bulgarian people supports Serbia!

Shame on the BG govt!! The article's title is correct, we did stab Serbia in the back. On behalf of all normal Bulgarians, I apologize for our corrupt officials.

It’s a very big shame for our politicians, over and over again … let’s hope that the ICJ will not share it

This is the same Bulgaria!

Nobody like s serbia ...
well done Bulgaria thank you.

there is a medicine for every disease, in this case it will be MUP !

A political blunder that will
we will feel in the long run.

Well done Buldaria, thank you. Straightforward! This is needed. As soon as you say the truth no worries for anything else. In this case you should either tell the truth (as you did), or try to defend Serbia's stand, with lies and fabrications. Choosing the second option would have been the hardest, as it's not easy to hide the evidences and facts about Kosovo. Normally you chose the best option, by telling the truth and hence standing on the right side, protecting justice. Thanks again.
Love

This is the same Bulgaria whose intelligence service fabricated a dossier against Serbia 10 years ago faking news against Serbia and the Serbs and (the Bulgarian agency) working for the German intelligence. This was the infamous 'Operation Horseshoe' dossier.

@Snug 'where are the decent bulgarians who will stand up and fight this corrupt polititians ?

These are the decent Bulgarians!, politicians are not corrupt because they do not agree with Europe's piraiah state number one. The future is the European Union and this union will would never accept Serbia without its recognition of Kosovo. The Serbis must either wake up and live in 2009 of face another decade or two in isolation.

Bulgaria has now a friend in Kosovo! Thank you.

do bulgarians have maps ? once in a while they should look at them, there they could see that a union with serbia would be even more benificial than the EU-membership...
they could cut off the gap between the black and the adriatic sea. which would make them more important than greece and turkey together...
but the germans are doing a good job in preventing this since hundreds of years...
it´s a shame how paid politicians in bulgaria are helping in this task .
SHAME ON YOU BULGARIA !
where [...]

Read the full comment are the decent bulgarians who will stand up and fight this corrupt polititians ?
THERE IS NO OTHER SOLUTION THAN SLAVIC UNION !
ONLY UNITY SAVES THE SLAVS !