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Sun, Nov 22 2009
UN mediator calls for ‘intensification’ of name dispute talks
Greek foreign minister Dora Bakoyannis.
Photo: Harald Dettenborn
Macedonian foreign minister Antonio Milososki.
The quest for a resolution to the long-standing dispute over the use of the name "Macedonia" resumed with a meeting in Geneva on June 22 2009 between United Nations mediator Matthew Nimetz and representatives of Athens and Skopje.
Nimetz told a news conference that his meetings with Greek envoy Adamantios Vassilakis and Macedonia’s Zoran Jolevski had produced no breakthrough.
Nimetz called for an intensification of the process of seeking a solution, which has been on hold pending Macedonia’s presidential elections and Greece’s European Parliament elections.
Greece objects to the former Yugoslav republic calling itself Macedonia, saying that this is historically inappropriate and could be exploited to back up territorial claims in Greece. About 120 countries recognise Macedonia under that name.
Ahead of the meeting, Greek foreign minister Dora Bakoyannis called on Skopje to enter the new round of talks with a different attitude, hinting that European and Nato member state governments wanted Skopje to work harder on a compromise.
Bakoyannis said that she "would try" to meet her Macedonian counterpart Antonio Milososki, as he had requested, at a forthcoming OSCE foreign ministers meeting.
Macedonian prime minister Nikola Gruevski has said repeatedly that any solution that emerges from the Nimetz-brokered process would be put to a referendum in his country.
At the June 22 news conference, Nimetz said that positions on both sides were entrenched "but positions can change and accommodations can be made".
Several media reports have suggested that pressure is being put on Skopje to accept a compromise, even though officially success in solving the name dispute is not a precondition for Macedonia’s Nato and EU aspirations. Greece has blocked these ambitions pending a resolution of the dispute.
Nimetz is due to visit Skopje on July 6 and Athens on July 8.
Nimetz told a news conference that his meetings with Greek envoy Adamantios Vassilakis and Macedonia’s Zoran Jolevski had produced no breakthrough.
Nimetz called for an intensification of the process of seeking a solution, which has been on hold pending Macedonia’s presidential elections and Greece’s European Parliament elections.
Greece objects to the former Yugoslav republic calling itself Macedonia, saying that this is historically inappropriate and could be exploited to back up territorial claims in Greece. About 120 countries recognise Macedonia under that name.
Ahead of the meeting, Greek foreign minister Dora Bakoyannis called on Skopje to enter the new round of talks with a different attitude, hinting that European and Nato member state governments wanted Skopje to work harder on a compromise.
Bakoyannis said that she "would try" to meet her Macedonian counterpart Antonio Milososki, as he had requested, at a forthcoming OSCE foreign ministers meeting.
Macedonian prime minister Nikola Gruevski has said repeatedly that any solution that emerges from the Nimetz-brokered process would be put to a referendum in his country.
At the June 22 news conference, Nimetz said that positions on both sides were entrenched "but positions can change and accommodations can be made".
Several media reports have suggested that pressure is being put on Skopje to accept a compromise, even though officially success in solving the name dispute is not a precondition for Macedonia’s Nato and EU aspirations. Greece has blocked these ambitions pending a resolution of the dispute.
Nimetz is due to visit Skopje on July 6 and Athens on July 8.
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Macedonia name dispute talks remain at ‘dead end’
Greece has not accepted the amended ‘Republic of North Macedonia’ usage proposal, while UN mediator Matthew Nimetz is scheduled to hear Skopje’s response on August 20 2009.
UN mediator signals optimism about Macedonia name dispute
Matthew Nimetz has put an ‘informal time limit’ of October for resolving the dispute, Greek newspaper says after mediator meets officials in Athens, while top government officials in Skopje were to meet to discuss amended proposal.
UN mediator proposes amended compromise in ‘name dispute’
In Skopje, Matthew Nimetz says that he is confident that ‘Macedonia’ name dispute will be solved and that a new proposal has been put forward – leading to media speculation that the idea is based on the ‘North Macedonia’ concept.
‘Name dispute’ mediator in Skopje
Matthew Nimetz arrives in Skopje on July 6 2009 for talks on Macedonia name dispute, before heading to Greece; says that if both parties make serious efforts, there could be a resolution soon.
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And the rest of the world couldn't care a monkey's about the Macedonia name issue !
And this is important to the rest of the world because??????
Get a life
Pwy yn medd a rwyn Saesneg? (Who said I was English ?) Not all British people are English, like not all Macedonians are Greeks.
Garedig iawn i chwi
I'm sorry but we have adapted and the David Effect no longer works.
Do go tell your infinite knowledge to someone who cares. And oh, a lot of Europeans hate England, they think you're barbarians who massacred Indians and aboriginals. But do you care what the world thinks of you? So what makes you think we care what you think or say?
gosh you can't take a hint can you, old man. I sure hope there arent any greeks in the seniors home you will be put in as this might upset you too much
Constantinople - yes, sacked by the Fourth Crusade 1n 1104, followed by capture by the Ottoman Turks in 1453 and 350 years of Turkish rule over Greece.. yes , great place and a great triumph for Greece. In Roman days they called it a "Pyrrhic Victory".....
David, your tactics are not working anymore...funny thing about humans is that we eventually learn and adapt. But then again I understand you're old and your immune system is not up to scratch you poor old thing. Must be sad that you cant get on your motorcycle and travel around Europe like you once did
Say hi to the ancient macedonians when you cross over to the otherside...but be warned, they do not speak english nor Skopjan/Bulgarian but Greek!
haha, yes we lost to the Romans who we eventually took over. Ever heard of Constantinople?
And seriously, who in the world really cares whether Greece wins or loses??? I think you need to get off your computer and see a little bit of the world. So sad you waste your last years on this world on this issue that the world beyond Europe never hears about
PS - does it sadden you that when you die nobody will remember you? are you trying to get the Skops to build a statue of you so that you're not forgotten? Sorry but you have to Alexander or Phillip for them to build a statue!
It's all here from the UNHCR (2009)- Greece "in the dock" about its treatment of its Macedonian minorities:
http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/pdfid/49b7b2e52.pdf
Not my words, but UNHCR's. Nimetz will of course be aware of this, as a senior UN official.
Dream on, Hellas, you're about to lose this battle, as you lost Macedonia to the Romans in 146 BC.
hahaha, nice try David. I know your game...trying to antagonize the Greeks. Oh well, if it makes your last few year on this Earth happy then so be it. And when you die, you can report to the Ottomans how you fared and don't be surprised if they laugh at you because what you're trying to do, they could not accomplish in 400 years of slavery.
Unless you are the USA or the Albanian minority demanding to federalize Skopje then there's absolutely nothing you can do to influence this issue. Nobody cares what you say, in fact the majority of the readers dont go beyond your first word.
What Macedonian minority are you referring to? The Greeks who reside in the Province of Macedonia self identify themselves as Macedonians but then again you and everyone else do not care about their right to the Macedonian identity.
This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained .
to Common Sense - I'm afraid you got your maths wrong. Out of the 196 UN member-nations, 120 have so far recognised "FYROM" as being simply "Republic of Macedonia", i.e. 62%, which is rather a majority.
Meanwhile, everybody might find the attached URL interesting: it is the recent (March 2009) UNHCR report on Greece and its treatment of minorities, which is highly critical about Greek treatment of ethnic Macedonians within its borders. Nimitz will have it too, as a senior UN offical. Meanwhile, enjoy....
http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/pdfid/49b7b2e52.pdf
Chago
Yes! Very good point
how did he do it in citca 50 years
i really don't understand.
To Common Sense, my question has nothing to do with races, but about the utilization of the Macedonia name. You misunderstand what I wanted to say.
Nevermind, I send you my biggest applauds and respect for this reasonable and objective comment you wrote below:
"I agree with the fact that Fyrom does NOT deserve the name Macedonia not even North, South,East or West Macedonia.Slavic Fyrom-ians are not Greeks,not Macedonians and not Albanians/ Illyrians,they are slavic and have to learn to live with that.Every one can make History,but no one can change it".
That proves me you are a wise man which accepts the historic facts, instead of trying to distort them for other purposes. Thank you.
@ Alexander the Greek ,You said: <"FYROM is composed by slavic and albanian races. I don't know understand what they have to do with Macedonia??"> There is no such a thing like "Slavic and Albanian races ",the race is the same as yours(white) but,the nationality is different!!!According to you,how many races are in the World ?Damn it,educate your self before you "try" to comment on something that you have no clue.I wont be surprised if you search Wikipedia and come up with the UN members ( 192 countries + Kosovo,Palestine,Taiwan etc = 196 + races)!!!I agree with the fact that Fyrom does NOT deserve the name Macedonia not even North, South,East or West Macedonia.Slavic Fyrom-ians are not Greeks,not Macedonians and not Albanians/ Illyrians,they are slavic and have to learn to live with that.Every one can make History,but no one can change it.
There are two "Macedonias". With two different meanings. Two different definitions. Both, in my opinion, are valid. It is not "us or them", "either they are Macedonian or we are Macedonian". Greece should drop the whole thing. The national Macedonians have their traditions, national heroes and revolutionary movements in the region of Macedonia. And the Greeks have their historical Macedonian region, with their heroes and traditions. They're just different. As a Greek, I have no trouble accepting my northern neighbours as Macedonian. Or their country as Macedonia. At the same time I'm proud of Macedonia, and its history in northern Greece. Why can't we accept them and move on? They are not brainwashed. Their ancestors, in my opinion, were Bulgarian. But since 1992 they have not united with Bulgaria, so they are no longer Bulgarian. And for 17 years they have not budged an inch on changing the name of their country. So, they must believe they have a right to call themselves Macedonian. I say let them have the name. It's a Greek name anyway, and we should be flattered. Its a shame nobody has tried to understand the other side. If civil war breaks out in FYROM between the Albanians and slav-Macedonians, and people are killed, we Greeks will be blamed for not stabilising this country into NATO and the EU. Greece has changed alot the last thirty years, but is still not quite like her western European allies. She is still caught up in too much nationalism. Greeks should ease up a little, and see this issue in perspective.
what I'd like to know is how Tito was able to brainwash western Bulgarians so that they forgot who they were? that area was the heart of ancient Bulgaria, so only 47 years of communist propaganda works on them, while 74 years was not enough for other Slavs to believe all the other communist lies? there is something else wrong here, no one can make ancient Macedonians Greeks into Slavs, yet Tito managed to pull that off? and how were they able to brainwash most of the expatriates? I know many people hate to study history here in the US, but even in the rest of the world? a Slavic state that is only 15% of ancient Macedonia can not be Macedonia, it would be like Belgium claiming it was England & that it was the remnant of the British Empire and that the Plantagenets, Tutors and Stewards were Belgians.
This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained .
This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained .
Everyone knows Alexander was born in Edessa, in the macedonian region of Greece. So what's the deal there?
FYROM is composed by slavic and albanian races. I don't know understand what they have to do with Macedonia??
This comment has been removed by the moderator because it contained .